Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

23-07-2022 20:47

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Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Stefan Jakobsson, 23-07-2022 20:47

I made an abundant collection of some Preussia/Sporormiella on dung of hazel grouze (Tetrastes bonasia) in western Finland. It is somewhere in the neighbourhood of leporina - subtilis but I have difficulties in finding a good match.

The spores are (26.7) 27.8 - 34.9 (36.9) × (4.8) 5.0 - 6.3 (6.8) µm, soon breaking up into four part spores. The asci are (108.7) 120.4 - 151.5 (184.7) × (10.1) 11.6 - 14.2 (14.6) µm. Other details in the photos.

Ideas, anybody?

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Update: I was wrong about the substrate - it is black grouse (Tetrao/Lyrurus tetrix).

Enrique Rubio, 23-07-2022 21:11

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Hi Stefan
Why not minima?

Stefan Jakobsson, 23-07-2022 21:23

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Thank you!

I looked also at minima but the the ascus should be 80-100 µm, below abruptly contracted into a very short stipe according to Ahmed and Cain. I don't think that is a good match.

Enrique Rubio, 23-07-2022 21:33

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Indeed, your asci appear more elongated, but you must take into account the natural stretching of the asci before the dehiscence of the exotunica.

Stefan Jakobsson, 23-07-2022 21:37

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Also, I can't see a kink in the middle of the germ slit.

Michel Delpont, 24-07-2022 09:28

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Hello Stefan

Look towards S.minimoides, the germinal clefts correspond better. The spores and measurements of these two species are quite variable.

Michel.

Stefan Jakobsson, 24-07-2022 14:41

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Thank you!

The pseudothecia are about double size when compared to descriptions of minimoides. I measured the the part of the ascus base to the lowest spore and got these results (11.5) 13.8 - 58 (101.9) µm, Me = 33.9 µm while Ahmed & Cain say 4-6 µm. The spore width is a better match with minima than with minimoides.

I also compared to these and other photos:

https://www.pilzforum.eu/board/thread/46967-sporormiellas-aus-namibia/

Minimoides is said to be a thermophilic species. This specimen was collected on grey dunes on a south facing slope exposed to sun all day, so the thermophily criterion is fulfilled. The species is on the Finnish checklist but I know no details about that.

I feel that the differences are too big for this to be minimoides. But then my experience of this genus is limited

Norbert Heine, 25-07-2022 13:16

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Hello Stefan,

this can't be Sporormiella minima or minimoides because of the long ascus stipe and a germ slit without a kink in the middle. The asci of this two species are also much shorter and broader. Sporormiella leporina has more compact ascospores never shorter than 30 µm and very short necked pseudothecia (often you didn't see the neck). In my opinion your species is Sporormiella subtilis. The size of the asci fits perfectly with your measurements (Ahmed & Cain: 120-160 x 12-14). Maybe you measured some spores where the cells start to drift apart? This could explain the measurements longer than 30 µm. We compared the species with Sp. leporina in this discussion in the Pilzforum.eu.

Best regards, Norbert

Stefan Jakobsson, 25-07-2022 14:37

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

My best guess was also subtilis. But the spores... I actually got the same idea that I had measured some disintegrating spores so I measured 30 new spores very carefully taking care that all spores were intact. But that did not change the result; they are still too long.

Pilzforum.eu is my favourite site what comes to coprophilous species. Unfortunately I don't write German even though I can read it. Thank you, Norbert!

Michel Delpont, 25-07-2022 18:14

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Good evening.

Taking all the information and the latest details, I wonder if S.leporina would not be more suitable for the length of the spores as well as their shape.

Michel.

Norbert Heine, 25-07-2022 20:18

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Hello Michel, it's a difficult species what Stefan shows us!

I should investigate the species myself to be able to make a judgement. But I'm sure that this is not Sporormiella leporina, which I know from more than 50 collections.

The spores of leporina are more compact and do not disintegrate into individual parts.

The constrictions at the septa are much too deep for leporina.

The germ slits of leporina are more or less parallel and never oblique.

And the pseudothecia are without a clearly neck.

I don't know the species, maybe it's a a new one. But Sporormiella leporina I want to exclude.

Regards, Norbert

Michel Delpont, 26-07-2022 09:48

Re : Preussia/Sporormiella on grouse dung

Agree with you, but it was only a track!

Michel.

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