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04-10-2024 17:08

Birgit Lüthje

I just found a very similar ascomycet on a heap of

03-10-2024 20:56

Margot en Geert Vullings

These orange discs were found in September on mois

01-10-2024 17:02

B Shelbourne B Shelbourne

• Habitat and macro suggest Chlorociboria.• P

01-10-2024 16:15

Lothar Krieglsteiner Lothar Krieglsteiner

.. on deciduous twig, on and near old specimens of

01-10-2024 11:14

Michel RIMBAUD

Bonjour,La semaine dernière en réoltant des mycÃ

30-09-2024 22:15

Alan Smith

I found a 'forest' of hair-like structures on the

29-09-2024 13:17

B Shelbourne B Shelbourne

• Macro and habitat suggested Ciboria, and C. ba

22-09-2024 20:24

Robin Isaksson Robin Isaksson

Dear all, I did found this one on on S. acauli

08-09-2024 21:31

B Shelbourne B Shelbourne

• Stromatised substrate and macro like genus Rut

26-09-2024 17:25

Hans-Otto Baral Hans-Otto Baral

Does someone have a pdf of this paper? I have it

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Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
B Shelbourne, 08-09-2024 21:31
B Shelbourne• Stromatised substrate and macro like genus Rutstroemia.
• Micro seems good for Rutstroemia too.
• Quercus petioles, macro, and spores suggest R. sydowiana.

Habitat: Stromatised petiole of Quercus robur, well-decayed leaf (but luckily the apex was intact), at the top of damp leaf litter, next to a pond, mixed deciduous woodland, Low Weald, England, early September, after lots of rain.

Apothecia: Appears to have been two, light brownish to blackish with yellowish disc, superficial, diameter ~3 mm and height similar, tooth-like groups of marginal hairs with exudate, concolourous with disc, disc appears shallow and plano-concave in maturity, with gelatinous appearance, receptacle with uneven and felty texture, darker network of hyphae visible, stipitate, blackened in lower-part, stromatised petiole with blackened mummified appearance.

Associates: Further up the petiole/mid-rib, several tiny, whitish, stipitate apothecia, size and colouring suggests a different species.

Asci: ~120-130 x 10-12 um, cylindrical-clavate, 8-spored, biseriate when turgid, croziers, apical ring strongly bb, seems like typical Rutstroemia form, apex rounded-truncate, more truncate when flaccid, apical thickening noticeable when immature or flaccid.

Spores: Reniform, apex hemispherical, base +/- acute, noticeably to strongly curved in profile view, inside the asci apparently filled with many tiny VBs but most coalescing in free spores to form ~3 large to medium VBs, apparently aseptate and uninuclear.

Measurements in water or IKI: (12.5) 13-15 × 5-6 µm, Q = (2.2) 2.5 - 2.76 (2.8), n = 10, mean = 14.1 × 5.4 µm, Q mean = 2.6.

Paraphyses: Long, cylindrical, irregularly inflated toward apex (~2.5-5 um), occasionally branched or bent at apex, multi-septate, apical cells filled with large yellowish VBs, possibly taller than the asci, some noticeable amyloid contents.

Marginal cells/hairs: Multiseptate, ~2-4 cells protruding, irregularly cylindrical, apparently gelatinised, with orangish brown exudate, around margin and on flanks, associated with the darker hyphae on the surface of the excipulum.

Medullary: Textura intricata (typica), appears to be separated from ectal ex. by several rows of horizontal hyphae, looks darker towards subhymenium.

Ectal ex: Hyaline, narrow hyphae on the surface, textura porrecta, patches of exudate, underneath large cells, textura prismatica, cells size seems to distinguish from horizontal hyphae.
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Hans-Otto Baral, 09-09-2024 16:39
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
Nothing to add, a clear species and highly confined to the petioles of oak or sometimes chestnut.
B Shelbourne, 09-09-2024 18:08
B Shelbourne
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
Thank you.

I had a suspicion that the spore shape and substrate would be distinguishing, and then I found this species in your Rutstroemia folder. I also saw R. quercina reported on petioles of similar trees but there is only the sketch and the spores look different.
Luc Bailly, 12-09-2024 20:41
Luc Bailly
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
I'll add Rutstroemia petiolorum is easy to recognize in the woods, it has the same ecology but a much longer stipe.
Hans-Otto Baral, 12-09-2024 21:05
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
R. quercina has hairy apos and is a dubious taxon.

R. petiolorum is always on Fagus, and I am not sure if there is a tendency to longer stalks, in any case there is much overlap. In spore shape there is no possibility of confusion.
B Shelbourne, 13-09-2024 11:45
B Shelbourne
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
In the folder for R. petiolorum, I noticed all the observations are on Fagus, except the B&K entry. This refers to a specimen on Quercus and gives it as a substrate. Is there some confusion here?

From the photos, the spores of R. petiolarum look distinctly more allantoid with a different pattern of VBs (and often with a lump protruding from each pole).

Hans-Otto Baral, 13-09-2024 11:54
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
It is actually strange that Quercus is mentioned along with Fagus in Dennis 1978, Moser 1963, and Ellis & Ellis 1985. Baral & krieglsteiner 1985 and Palmer 1994 give only Fagus. More references I do not have in my database.

The polar caps are gel sheaths which P. sydowiana does not seem to have.

The LBs (not VBs) are similar in the 2 species but R. sydowiana has a central big LB because of the higher spore width.

Roberge wrote "Fagus, etc." and did not give a spore width, but mentioned two globose drops.
B Shelbourne, 13-09-2024 17:52
B Shelbourne
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
Thank you for the correction and references.

The sizes of the LBs depend on the spore shape, but it could still be helpful for visual confirmation.

The discussion around the protologue for R. petiolorum in Desm. says sometimes Quercus and Castanea, but at least one of the type collections looks like Fagus leaves (Desmazières, Pl. Crypt., Ed. 2, no. 658).


B&K 155 for R. petiolorum gives Fraxinus and Quercus and then adds Fagus. The main specimen is reported on Quercus but I find the drawing of spores hard to interpret and there are no LBs. I noticed R. longipes on Fraxinus petioles but this seems quite different.

Hans-Otto Baral, 13-09-2024 20:40
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
Yes it is very helpful symmetrical in petiolorum vs. asymmetrical in sydowiana.

I read Desm. p. 97, he link from Index Fungorum. Habitat in petiolis foliorum emortuorum Fagi etc.

The spores of B&K are dead, therefore no LBs visible. Hosts are often misidentified, I would only believe if I saw the voucher. Spore shae and size would fit petiolorum. R. longipes spores are shorter and never as allantoid as in B&K.
Martin Bemmann, 13-09-2024 20:45
Martin Bemmann
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
In the current list of the exsiccata of the Mycological Society Lucerne:



the collection on quercus leaves mentioned in B&K is now listed under Lanzia petiolorum (see entry 6544). which is no official name?

And it was found on a mix of leaves of quercus and fagus...

Regards

Martin
Hans-Otto Baral, 13-09-2024 21:38
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
This means there is no proof for petiolorum growing on oak because it could be a mixture of both species, each on its host, and the micro was taken solely from Fagus.
B Shelbourne, 14-09-2024 13:00
B Shelbourne
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
So, the idea that R. petiolorum and R. sydowiana can be distiguished by both spores and petiole genera is supported by the type material and all reliable observations.
Hans-Otto Baral, 14-09-2024 17:13
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
There exist various sequences of R. sydowiana, several on Quercus, others without indication of the host. But there is only 1 incomplete sequence (only ITS1) of R. petiolorum (on "Quercus or Fagus").

It has 2.5% distance to R. sydowiana and only 2% to R. punicae.
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Valencia Lopez Francisco Javier, 27-09-2024 19:37
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
Hola amigos
Si, es cierto que R. sydowiana es una especie claramente confinada a los peciolos de las hojas de roble, pero en ocasiones también pueden crecer en las cupulas donde crece el fruto, en mi caso de Quercus faginea (Adjunto fotos), es solo una apreciación.
Saludos a todos
Curro Valencia
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Hans-Otto Baral, 27-09-2024 21:00
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
Very nice!! I would place the pics in my folder, which date can I attach?
Valencia Lopez Francisco Javier, 27-09-2024 21:21
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
Hola Zotto
Esta coleccion fue recolectada el 12-12-2017
Saludos
Curro Valencia
Hans-Otto Baral, 27-09-2024 21:55
Hans-Otto Baral
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
Thanks!
B Shelbourne, 29-09-2024 13:13
B Shelbourne
Re : Possible Rutstroemia sydowiana
Thank you for this contribution to the discussion. I think cupules are an interesting substrate and this observations adds to my interest.