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asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Bernard CLESSE,
06-03-2016 22:19
Voici un asco sur place à feu que je pense être Tricharina gilva (mais ma première observation de l'espèce si c'est lui) :a) asques octosporés, IKI-
b) spores elliptiques, lisses et sans guttules : 17-19x10-12
c) poils hyalins, septés, à parois épaisses, coniques mais à apex arrondi
d) paraphyses filiformes, à extrémité graduellement élargie
Bernard
Uwe Lindemann,
06-03-2016 23:52
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Hi Bernhard,
yes, it could be Tricharina gilva but I have to add "sensu latu" because there are different taxa which are intermingled under the epithet "gilva" .
Best, Uwe
yes, it could be Tricharina gilva but I have to add "sensu latu" because there are different taxa which are intermingled under the epithet "gilva" .
Best, Uwe
Gilbert MOYNE,
06-03-2016 23:58
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Bonsoir,
J'aurais plutôt pensé à Tricharina praecox...
Gilbert
J'aurais plutôt pensé à Tricharina praecox...
Gilbert
Peter Püwert,
07-03-2016 00:13
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Hi all,
I would favor even Tricharina ascophanoides.
Here some literature, the last two unfortunately in german.
Greetings Peter.
DOUGOUD, R. (2002): Contribution à la connaissance de quelques Discomycètes operculés rares ou méconnus. Fungi non delineati. Pars. XVIII Alassio.
ENGEL, H., HÄFFNER, J. (1986): Tricharina ascophanoides (Boud.) Yang et Korf, ein seltener Ascomycet für die Bundesrepublik, gefunden in Nordwestoberfranken. Die Pilzflora Nordwestoberfrankens 10: 47-49.
LINDEMANN, U. (2013): Trouble with Tricharina Eckblad. About a difficult genus of the operculate discomycetes. Mycol. Bav. 14.
I would favor even Tricharina ascophanoides.
Here some literature, the last two unfortunately in german.
Greetings Peter.
DOUGOUD, R. (2002): Contribution à la connaissance de quelques Discomycètes operculés rares ou méconnus. Fungi non delineati. Pars. XVIII Alassio.
ENGEL, H., HÄFFNER, J. (1986): Tricharina ascophanoides (Boud.) Yang et Korf, ein seltener Ascomycet für die Bundesrepublik, gefunden in Nordwestoberfranken. Die Pilzflora Nordwestoberfrankens 10: 47-49.
LINDEMANN, U. (2013): Trouble with Tricharina Eckblad. About a difficult genus of the operculate discomycetes. Mycol. Bav. 14.
Uwe Lindemann,
07-03-2016 08:37
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Yes, Gilbert, you are right, it could be also T. praecox due to the hyaline hairs and the somewhat narrowed spores at the poles. Bernhard should check the ornamentation of the spores tested by cotton blue in lactophenol. If they are finely warted it is praecox.
@ Peter: I didn't think of ascophanoides because of the straight hairs and the color of the apos. In my experience fruitbodies of ascophanoides are always brownish with a slightly reddish tint.
Best, Uwe
@ Peter: I didn't think of ascophanoides because of the straight hairs and the color of the apos. In my experience fruitbodies of ascophanoides are always brownish with a slightly reddish tint.
Best, Uwe
Bernard CLESSE,
07-03-2016 09:53
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Hello Uwe, Peter and Gilbert,
Thank you very much for your opinions and comments!
I have no information about Tricharina praecox but I'll redo preparations to show the hairs and spores in blue cotton.
I'll keep you informed.
Best regards
Bernard CLESSE,
07-03-2016 15:11
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Hello to all three,
I observed spores in blue cotton and I have not seen ornamentation.
The hairs are brownish young then become hyaline.
Do you see more clearly?
Best regards,
Bernard
Peter Püwert,
07-03-2016 17:14
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Hi Uwe,
likely you are right, it is not Tr. ascoph. The title of your treatise has proved true one more time for me: " The trouble .... ".
How is the spores size valued here, actually? So big spores like from Bernard have not measured many Tricharina, also not from You suggested.
Look to you at the photos of Tr. ascoph. from DOUGOUD because of the colouring.
Greetings Peter.
I had forgotten the treatise:
YANG, C. S. and KORF R. P. (1985): A monograph of the genus Tricharina and of a new, segregate genus, Wilcoxina (Pezizales). Mycotaxon 24: 467-531.
likely you are right, it is not Tr. ascoph. The title of your treatise has proved true one more time for me: " The trouble .... ".
How is the spores size valued here, actually? So big spores like from Bernard have not measured many Tricharina, also not from You suggested.
Look to you at the photos of Tr. ascoph. from DOUGOUD because of the colouring.
Greetings Peter.
I had forgotten the treatise:
YANG, C. S. and KORF R. P. (1985): A monograph of the genus Tricharina and of a new, segregate genus, Wilcoxina (Pezizales). Mycotaxon 24: 467-531.
Peter Püwert,
07-03-2016 17:24
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Hi Bernard,
I send you some literature
Greetings Peter.
I send you some literature
Greetings Peter.
Ueli Graf,
07-03-2016 20:43
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Hallo Peter,
könntest du mir
LINDEMANN, U. (2013): Trouble with Tricharina Eckblad. About a difficult genus of the operculate discomycetes. Mycol. Bav. 14.
YANG, C. S. and KORF R. P. (1985): A monograph of the genus Tricharina and of a new, segregate genus, Wilcoxina (Pezizales). Mycotaxon 24: 467-531.
Auch senden?
Mit bestem Dank
Ueli
könntest du mir
LINDEMANN, U. (2013): Trouble with Tricharina Eckblad. About a difficult genus of the operculate discomycetes. Mycol. Bav. 14.
YANG, C. S. and KORF R. P. (1985): A monograph of the genus Tricharina and of a new, segregate genus, Wilcoxina (Pezizales). Mycotaxon 24: 467-531.
Auch senden?
Mit bestem Dank
Ueli
Uwe Lindemann,
07-03-2016 23:31
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Hi Bernhard,
if the spores are smooth (the ormentation can be only seen at mature spores, that means the spores have a refractive layer) it should be gilva s. lat. In the literature gilva-spores could be such as big as measured. But in my experience there is a difference of 1-2 µm in the lenght between immature spores (with observable content as you mostly showed us) and mature spores (with refractive layer).
Best, Uwe
if the spores are smooth (the ormentation can be only seen at mature spores, that means the spores have a refractive layer) it should be gilva s. lat. In the literature gilva-spores could be such as big as measured. But in my experience there is a difference of 1-2 µm in the lenght between immature spores (with observable content as you mostly showed us) and mature spores (with refractive layer).
Best, Uwe
Bernard CLESSE,
08-03-2016 19:28
Re : asco sur place à feu : Tricharina gilva ?
Bonsoir à tous,
J'ai mesuré 20 spores. Voici les résultats : 12,5-19,5x8-11
moyenne = 16,5x9,6
Q = 1,72
J'ai revérifié une nouvelle fois les spores dans le bleu coton : pas d'ornementation visible.
J'ai également mesuré la longueur de 5 grands poils : 210-228-270-280-290
Bernard
J'ai mesuré 20 spores. Voici les résultats : 12,5-19,5x8-11
moyenne = 16,5x9,6
Q = 1,72
J'ai revérifié une nouvelle fois les spores dans le bleu coton : pas d'ornementation visible.
J'ai également mesuré la longueur de 5 grands poils : 210-228-270-280-290
Bernard
