Dear Ismail

do you know
Korf, R. P. 1973h. Chapter 9. Discomycetes and Tuberales, pp. 249-319 in G. C. Ainsworth, F. K. Sparrow, & A. S. Sussman [eds.], The Fungi, an Advanced Treatise, Volume IVA. A Taxonomic Review with Keys: Ascomycetes and Fungi Imperfecti. New York: Academic Press.
?
Korf provides such a key to families and genera you might be able to adjust to your needs.

Regards
Martin

Hi Ismail

you intend here something which is extremely complex. I assume you worked on a given area and found a series of species which you now want to key out. Forget it if you want to key out any generic concept by including species that you did not have. Generic concepts differ severely among authotrs, and they change every year.

First, it is important to know which species you had, and how you have documented and identified them. For instance, Pyrenopeziza and Mollisia you can easily separate by their paraphysis contentc, but only when you have studied them in the living condition. If not, then I would first doubt if you have identified the genus correctly.

Some genera are doubtful, for instance Haglundia is a Mollisia in my opinion, and Gemmina a Calycina.

If you want to send me your Helotiales, I can try to help you.

Zotto

Hi
no it is not too complicated
just very simple and short sentences, for example;

Apotecium edge is white hairy............................................. Hyaloscyphaceae
Apotecium edge smooth or glabrous.................................... Helotiaceae
Ascospores rotundate or spherical....................................... Caloscyphaceae

for example;
Dothideomycetes, Leotiomycetes, Orbiliomycetes, Pezizomycetes, Sordariomycetes
class distinction, There may be two or three words. What is the most prominent feature

Apotecium edge is white hairy............................................. Hyaloscyphaceae
Apotecium edge smooth or glabrous.................................... Helotiaceae

... but it is not so simple - not at all.

There are a lot of Hyaloscyphaceae with smooth margins, for instance. Zotto is fully right in what he is writing.

I fear that disappoints you, but it is the truth.

Regards from Lothar

This is true, yes. We have, for instance, Species which have reduced spore discharge and got perithecioid or mazaedioid, but they belong in Helotiales.

In the Helotiaceae we now have species with brown stiff setae, previously placed in Rutstroemiaceae. In this case the apical amyloid ring gives the direction, but when it is reduced you don't recognize the family....

It is very difficult to give a single character fr an order or family that every member has.

Hi Zotto,

when you see what is going on in Basidiomycetes, this is not really surprising.

For instance, Clavaria and Clavulinopsis (club fungi)  are related to Arrhenia or Camarophyllopsis (with stipe and gills), Cyathus and Lycoperdon are closest to Agaricus and Lepiota, hypogeic fungi belong to nearly all groups of BAsidiomycetes (and to Ascomycetes), and Serpula belongs to the Boletales. Similarity and relationship are very different things now.

Best regards from Lothar